Gard and Cornelia had only been married a short time( 1-2 years) when Nellies Promise takes place.
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Gard and Cornelia had only been married a short time( 1-2 years) when Nellies Promise takes place.
I'm glad I wasn't the only one who thought this! [img]redface.gif[/img]
My problem isn't that Samantha is living with her aunt and uncle. I think it's good for her to live with people closer to the age her parents would have been...it makes sense.
But, it is totally out of Grandmary's character. She's very stern and doesn't like the fact that Cornelia is "newfangled." Would the character she was in books 1-5 let Samantha move in with Cornelia permanently? It's doubtful. She was trying very hard to teach Samantha to be ladylike and already thought she was headed down the wrong path.
In addition, almost every time Samantha's living arrangements are mentioned in book #6, it's with a comment that Grandmary and the Admiral are on a trip. By always connecting these two references, it makes her living arrangements sound temporal (except on the last page).
It's not that the book is wrong in the fact that Samantha lives with Cornelia and Gard. It is, however, missing an adequate explanation on why Samantha is permanently living with her aunt and uncle, because it's out of character for Grandmary to have made such a decision.
Something I've learned in college writing classes is "the reader should not have to assume anything." Book #6 requires too much "assuming" on the part of the readers, and that's why there is confusion and the book can be read two ways. I hope the movie will fill in the gaps here...it would be interesting to know! [img]biggrin.gif[/img]
<font color="#051E50" size="1">[ September 02, 2004 08:34 AM: Message edited by: Melissa ]</font>
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">The way I read is that they are 10. I don't think it is specifically addressed, but I go by this timeline:Quote:
Originally posted by Melissa:
How old are Nellie, Samantha, and Nellie's sisters in the book? Since it takes place in 1906, are Samantha and Nellie 12? Or are they still 10?
Late Summer 1904: Meet Samantha (age 9)
Fall 1904: Samantha Learns a Lesson (age 9)
December 1904: Samantha's Surprise (age 9)
May 1905: Happy Birthday Samantha! (age 10)
Summer 1905: Samantha Saves the Day (age 10)
Late January/Early February 1906: Changes for Samantha (age 10)
Nellie's Promise picks up in March 1906, so really quite literally after Changes for Samantha.
That is probably why Samantha is still with Cornelia and Gard...because Grandmary and the Admiral wouldn't have returned yet!
As far as permanent arrangements, it probably would just make more sense for all the girls to stay with Cornelia and Gard rather than for Grandmary and the Admiral to suddenly be responsible for four girls. Now that Cornelia and Gard were married, it was a more "appropriate" family for Samantha (and later Nellie, Bridget, and Jenny.)
I just reskimmed Changes for Samantha and can see it both ways. On one hand, they never come out and directly say that Samantha is there temporarily and will be returning to Mt. Bedford at a later date. Grandmary and Admiral don't seem to have a specific time line that they are on or mention a return, it just says they are sailing around the world. In the postcard they send, it doesn't say "see you soon!" or anything like that. In the Family & Friends, it only says they are living on the Admiral's yacht. You could even interpret that to mean they are permanently residing aboard the Admiral's yacht. I do think it's wrong for them to have you make assumptions, but then again I had to remind myself that this is a book for around ages 8 & up. While some 8 year olds would pick up on a discrepency like that, they are probably hoping since the ending is so "romanticized" and girls would be so thrilled with the new family that they won't wonder about poor Grandmary.
I always thought the same thing, Melissa. I think that later Valerie Tripp decided to make her stay with Cornelia and Gard. I wonder how old Grandmary is? Do you think she may have passed away before Samantha was old enough to live on her own? Maybe they decided that she would go live with Gard anyway so they just kept her there. Cleopatra of the nile, I think your timeline is right on! I think that since they were traveling around the world, on a slow boat mind you, that they wouldn't return for years.
<font color="#051E50" size="1">[ September 02, 2004 09:49 PM: Message edited by: EmilyStrange ]</font>
Changes for Samantha was written a long time before anyone thought that there would be a Nellie doll or book. To add into the confusion Samanthas Ocean liner adventure takes place in the middle of the book. Time line questions are nothing new in childrens books. Plenty of books in the same mystery series begin on the first day of summer vacation and yet no one gets any older.
Another point to remember is that rich peoples vacations in Samanthas time could last a year or so.
I had a few minor complaints about the book. Why didn't Cornelia know basic words in German and Italian . At one time a wealthy woman was expected to know many foreign languages so that she could travel to Europe and understand literature and opera.
It is good that Nellies uncle was shown to be a villan right from the start.
In the book you can see the changes that 100 years can make. Now a wise Gard and Cornelia would reassure the children that they were protected from their uncle. Now Nellie could have called 911 at the first threat. Now even a wealthy girl like Samantha knows of the illness and poverty in the world.
It is also unusual for Nellie to have been admitted to the same school as Samantha. At one time there were all sorts of discriminatory rules at some private schools. Perhaps Gard and Cornelia had to make a "donation". I would have liked it better if the schools had been given names.
It was good when Nellie told the "alley rats" to get out of the way. I wonder if Nellie could become a lawyer instead of a teacher.
THe idea of Nellie having to protect her sisters is also overplayed ( unless they are sickly). There is not that much difference in their ages. By the time Nellie was able to teach the girls would only be a few years away from employment themselves.
I just read Nellie's Promise and it takes place RIGHT after Changes for Samantha while GrandMary and the Admiral are away. I always thought it was a permanent arrangement which I never liked when I was a kid because I felt bad for Samantha to have to leave her home, her school and her friends.
I thought the story was cute. A little predictible and unrealistic but it was sweet and I loved reading more about Nellie!
Did anyone notice in the vingette on p. 1 Nellie's hair is blond and then it keeps changing colors in each vingette which varies from the main illustrations?
I love Nellie's red sailor dress. I hope they make one for her!
I hope that AG makes the sailor dress for Nellie. It looks like something that she would actually wear. A similar dress for Samantha would be good too/
Here are some random thoughts on Nellie's Promise:
* I think it's a little jarring for the reader to be put in Nellie's head instead of Samantha's. Although it makes sense for the book, it seems like limited omniscient viewpoint in both Samantha and Nellie's point-of-view might have been easier to accept for readers (this is what I expected the book would be written in). But then it wouldn't have fit with a good portion of the plot.
* Samantha comes across as quite a different character when seen through Nellie's eyes. I can't quite place the difference, but Nellie comes across as the more outgoing of the two. In the original series I saw Nellie as demure and Samantha as outgoing. How many of you can realistically picture the Nellie in Samantha's series meanly yelling at a man she doesn't know, hands on hips, and calling him an "alley rat?" Samantha is even referred to as being "shy and unsure" (p. 29) at one point. Nellie has a much different view of Samantha than most readers would!
* Uncle Mike seems unrealistic...he's a bum yet he's working? The whole plot with him seemed unrealistic, especially how quickly and easily it ended. In fact, the notes in the book say the laws that Nellie, Gard, and Cornelia referred to were few in existance (75).
* Samantha's living arrangements were obscure in this book, too. However, two statements on p. 61 seem to really point to Samantha being a permanent member of Cornelia and Gard's family.
* Nellie's "controversial" purple silk pajamas do not exist in the book (see p. 37). She has a more conventional white nightgown with a blue ribbon.
* Was anyone else bothered by how two-dimensional "Bridget and Jenny" were? This is really noticeable on p. 41. Bridget and Jenny are always referred to as if they are only one person. I can't even tell them apart and don't know who is who. I hope the movie does a better job of giving each girl a unique personality.
* I really like what Nellie chose to do with her life!
Now that I have the book I can finally comment on others' observations (yay!) [img]wink.gif[/img] ...
I also thought it was odd that Cornelia didn't know phrases in other languages. I found it odd that Cornelia had not visited a settlement house on her own. She was never nervous about doing things against the norm such as speaking at a women's convention or visiting an orphanage. If she had wanted to go as badly as she claimed, I feel that she would have gone on her own. Later she decides to take a cab and keep going there. So why wouldn't she have gone in the first place?
I don't want to sound negative, though...it was great fun to read the next "chapter" in the lives of these beloved characters. I really hope an extra book is written for all of the series. [img]graemlins/thumbs_up.gif[/img]
<font color="#051E50" size="1">[ September 07, 2004 02:52 PM: Message edited by: Melissa ]</font>
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I thought the same thing about Addy's book. It was creepy.Quote:
Originally posted by mandasmom:
I think that it would be perfectly natural for grandparents to use "our girl" as a term of endearment for a granddaughter, especially since the Admiral knew Samantha so well and for so long (not to mention that she saved his life on the island). I always thought that she lived with Uncle Gard because his life had become settled since marrying Aunt Cornelia and they were closer to an appropriate age (and temprament) to be parents than Grandmary. I also thought that since they had been married for a while and there were no babies on the way that, although the book obviously never mentioned it, they might have had infertility problems-birth controll was non existent in those days so pregnancy was pretty much unavoidable. I always thought that it was nice that they were able to find exactly what each of them had been missing and create a wonderful family. (ok, I know, they're kids books and I'm reading WAY too much in them. Am I the only one that thought that in the first book of Addy's, that the visiting plantation owner who said how pretty Addy was and that maybe he would buy her to be his indoor servant, had perverted motives?)
I went right from book 1 to book 6 in Samantha's series, so I thought that she was now in the care of her Aunt & Uncle. I was presuming that Grandmary was now living on a boat, but when you point out the other possibilities, I can see how you thought that.
I have the mini-book that came with Nellie so I will have to read Nellie's promise with a magnifying glass, but I can't wait to read it. I'd love to read all of Samantha's books, but we seem to skip around. Right now, we're working on Kit's books.
Are Nellie's sisters twins? I really hate it how people see twins as one person instead of two separate people. (or like clones instead of twins).
thanks for all the insights.
I also thought the visiting plantation owner scene was creepy!
No Michele, Nellie's sisters are not twins, but it's interesting that you bring up people seeing twins as one person-you and Alison should read "One of a Kind Mallie" (same reading level as AG books). It's set during WWI and the main character, Mallie, is a twin who longs for her own identity.